2009/03/04

Flyers trade Upshall, get nothing in return




Flyers send Scottie Upshall and a 2nd Round pick to Phoenix for Daniel Carcillo. Carillo is just a thug on the ice with minimal talent. We already have Cote and Asham, why do we need a third tough guy. I had high hopes for the Giroux, Briere and Upshall line. I thought they could be an exciting line that could cause mismatches with other teams due to their speed and skill. The only thing that makes sense is the Flyers are dumping salary to make another move. The deadline has past, so it looks like that will not happen. It is unclear as to why the Flyers had to include a 2nd Round pick in this deal. Upshall for Cacillo straight up has the advantage going to Phoenix. All of this being said, Paul Holmgren has made great deals since taking over the duties of GM from Bobby Clarke. So I guess for now, we have to trust him.

8 comments:

Anonymous said...

This trade clears cap space and allows Giroux to stay with the parent club in case of further injuries or sickness. Carcillo, while not as a complete player as Upshall, has comparable offensive skills.

The Flyers also traded for McClaren who will serve for depth purposes.

Upshall's contract is up at the end of the year and will most likely get a raise from his current salary. More importantly, as stated earlier, this move allows the Flyers to maintain a more static lineup in case of injury/illness.

Stop being so short-sighted.

Roget said...

To say that Carcillo and Upshall have similar offensive skills is not true. This article was written before the trade for McClaren was announced. I read elsewhere that Upshall was traded to make sure Giroux stays with the Flyers in case of an injury, but right now everyone is healthy. If someone gets injured, they come off the books during their injury and a Phantom will replace them, so although I am not a cap expert, that excuse does not make sense. I also know that Upshall's contract is up and we would not be able to resign him. So explain to me the cap reasoning on how and why if someone like Hartnell gets hurt we would have to send Giroux to the minors if we would have kept Upshall.

Anonymous said...

it had to do with a d man getting hurt, because they would need to call up another d man to replace him, which would put them over the cap, because it was one more player added to the main roster. With Upshall gone, that isn't the case.

Anonymous said...

Roget--
Have you not paid any attention the past two weeks? Let me recap for you: Kimmo got sick and the Flyers called up Guenin to replace him. Since Kimmo didn't go on IR, his salary counts on the cap which put them over. Consequently, they sent down Giroux and brought up a Phantom (Ross I believe). Ross makes about 350k less than Giroux which put them just slightly under the cap.

Moving Upshall, who is an overrated player, will allow Giroux to stay in the lineup in case something like this happens again.

Have faith in Homer; I mean seriously, the guy only rebuilt the entire team within a couple of years. Give Carcillo a chance before you label him a bum. Upshall was a third line player; he will not be missed as much as ppl are making it out to be.

Roget said...

I do trust Homer, from the original article "All of this being said, Paul Holmgren has made great deals since taking over the duties of GM from Bobby Clarke. So I guess for now, we have to trust him." Thank you for explaining the cap situation, wise one. I didnt think about Kimmo getting the flu and no going on the DL.

Dr. G said...

Come on, Anonymous, why not just admit that you're really Joe Banner? While your learned exposition on cap space is as impressive as ever, we really don't want the Flyers to follow your Eagles blueprint to perpetual "close but no cigar" status. The goal is to put out the best team, not to earn a Ph.D. in Capology. There's simply no way that Upshall AND a 2nd round pick (?!) for Carillo makes any sense skill-wise. In this day & age in the NHL, a thug is detrimental, and the last thing the Flyers need is a reducton in overall team speed, an area in which they've always struggled. And picking up a minor league d-man in McLaren might make sense cap-wise as a hedge against injuries, but in terms of skill needs it's underwhelming to say the least. But thanks again for your dissertation on Capology, Joe! And I'm sure this will be the year that your formulas will finally work out for the Eagles...

Anonymous said...

This situation is going to put Holmers status as a GM in doubt until next season...

1) This move doesn't create that much cap space in the event of 2-3 injuries. If that were the case, then why part with a draft pick as well?
2) Dump Upshall's salary for oh, say, a 4th line center to replace Metropolit? Or a defenseman? For picks, not another salary.
3) Carcillo has 174 PIMS, we don't need more. he has 18 majors. so, subtract those 90 mins from 174 and you're left with 84 mins or 42 more minor penalities to the Flyers. Horrible. Upshall didn't put up many points or play defense, but Patrick Thorassen & Jim Dowd showed last year that role players make a difference.
4) No one has yet to Carcillo the next Rick Tocchet, so his mission will be very clear: keep his mouth shut, play brutally hard in the playoffs, stay out of the box, and prove he is a better addition than the underwelming, but fast, Upshall. That will be nearly impossible given his Steve Downie-like qualities.
5) None of the moves address goaltending. Nitty and Biron are unrestricted after the season, so it might have been wise, like Toronto, to grab Olag or Cam Ward as insurance.
6) The young core made the semi finals last year...this was the year to get that killer goaltender when it was clear Biron and Nitty weren't consistent. Otherwise, it's a gamble.
7) The Flyers are overloaded with talented young defensemen, including Svert in the minors (scoring leader). If they wanted a "horse" to help out, they needed to address this much sooner, like around the time when they sent Sbisis down. did Kimmo really say that the Flyers needed help on the blue line?
8) PLEASE, Holmer, don't tell me that the "fans" are gonna love this guy, I might. That's not the point. I would love Khabibulan even more.
9) Holmer has now clearly told his team, you're faster and tougher than last year when you went to the semi finals, so it's time to step it up.

Joe said...

Anonymous (2):

Who is Olag? Who is Sbisis? Who is Thorassen? (Olaf Kolzig? Luca Sbisa? Patrick Thoresen?)

The fact is that the goalie they wanted just was not out there. Bulin would have cost way too much, and look at what Kolzig DID cost. It is unreasonable to think they really could not have gotten more. On top of that, Carcillo had 13 goals last year. Upshall is going to get 10, MAYBE this year.

Plus, you kind of destroy your own argument when you say that Jim Dowd and Pat Thoresen and role players get the job done. That is what Carcillo is.